Sony patent infringement?

letshavetea · Post by **letshavetea** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 10:42 am

Narf Narf writes "According to Japan Today, the U.S. District Court in Oakland, California, has ordered Sony Computer Entertainment Inc. and its U.S. unit to pay $90.7 million in damages to Immersion Corp. for patent infringement over controllers used with PlayStation game consoles. In the ruling handed down Thursday, the federal court also ordered Sony Computer Entertainment and Sony Entertainment America Inc. to stop selling the PlayStation and PlayStation 2 game consoles using Dualshock controllers as well as more than 40 game software products." Update: 03/28 04:51 GMT by Z: ...which was followed immediately by an injunction, to allow Sony time for an appeal, and a compulsory licensing agreement.

read this on slashdot.com

these controllers have been around for like 10 years... why would they wait THIS LONG!?...

anyways... i wanna see whatll happen with this

SoDeepPolaris · Post by **SoDeepPolaris** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 11:06 am

"A number of media outlets are erroneously reporting that Sony can no longer sell its PSone and PS2 gaming consoles after losing a decision in their case against Immersion Corporation. Sony has been battling Immersion for some time now, as the two companies are disputing the technology behind Sony's DualShock vibration feedback system for controllers. Back in September of 2004, Sony lost to Immersion, and was ordered to pay $82 million in damages. Immersion would have also prevailed against Microsoft, but Microsoft wisely settled with them for about one-third that amount, and the other big players such as Nintendo have licensed the technology.

Immersion is the holder of US patents 6,275,213 and 6,424,333, covering "haptic feedback," i.e., the use of computer-controlled vibrating motors to provide tactile feedback to a user in a game or other application. According to Japan Today, Sony has lost their appeal, and is now ordered to pay $90.7 million in damages. Furthermore, Japan Today reports that Sony has been ordered "to stop selling the PlayStation and PlayStation 2 game consoles using Dualshock controllers as well as more than 40 game software products." This is not entirely true, however.

Courts records obtained by Ars Technica say that the injunction was immediately stayed by Judge Claudia Wilken. Wilken stayed the injunction so that Sony could prepare an appeal, and also forced Sony into a compulsory licensing scheme in the meantime. Sony would have been wise to settle as Microsoft did, as Immersion seems hell-bent on a permanent injunction."
-http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20050327-4739.html

So, apparently the patent is on the actual vibration technology of the dual shocks. Interesting...

CaseyDidder · Post by **CaseyDidder** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 12:07 pm

we've been discussing this on the PSP forums, its not the vibration they are suing over, its the controlled aspect of it. Anyways, sony already filed a appeal and is working on a contract with immersion.

letshavetea · Post by **letshavetea** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 12:27 pm

well i was listening to the radio and they had that on there... and they said it came from slashdot.. so i looked it up...

immersion is a lucky ass company lol

Original Sin · Post by **Original Sin** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 6:34 pm

All that shit over a controller that impersonates a sex toy? God damn. Oh well, I've already got mine anyway, not like it's that big a deal anyway.
So, if Sony loses this, they'll have to stop selling the playstation consoles bundled with Dualshock controllers, and by software games, they mean the games that support them? That'll be one hell of an inconvenience for anyone who wants older games.
It's great how this country's legan system can spend so much time and money on insignificant things like this, but here, there's a woman getting away with less than 2 years for killing her baby. Talk about getting away with murder.

Hoody2006 · Post by **Hoody2006** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 7:15 pm

can you imagine using the controllers with out duel shock after this long. I foudn one of my old ones with out D-S and it felt a little awkward

Post by Ho » Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:59 am

Actually, I generally find the simple vibration of Dual Shock and similar systems to be useless at best, annoying at worst. I almost always turn it off on games that use it. Now true force feedback, on the other hand, is a totally different story.

Post by **MonMotha** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 9:43 am

Ho wrote:Actually, I generally find the simple vibration of Dual Shock and similar systems to be useless at best, annoying at worst. I almost always turn it off on games that use it. Now true force feedback, on the other hand, is a totally different story.

As do I. However, I think that may be due to the types of games we tend to play (unless you're moonlighting playing Halo 2 on your X-Box and not telling me...traitor...). I agree that it's kinda pointless in music games like Pop'n or Beatmania or Rez where all it does is vibrate to the beat of the music (though at least with Rez there's the option of the female controller add-on). I usually just turn it off because it's distracting. I know that in some games though, they use the vibration to convey useful info like health. My roommate last year (you've heard about him) played a game where the health bar was this tiny thing in the corner (possibly a game design flaw, but read on), but used vibration to convey what your health level was. That way, in the middle of a fight, you didn't have to take your eyes off the battle to check your health status. That may not be the world's greatest use, but I could see it being useful. The vibration on the DS2 and such is a far cry from the original Nintendo Rumble Pack (which was neat only because of the novelty at the time).

CaseyDidder · Post by **CaseyDidder** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 10:58 am

Honestly, if a little vibration in your hands throws your concentration off, you obviously can't seem to hold it very well.

Fujiwara Bunta · Post by **Fujiwara Bunta** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:23 am

Ho wrote:Actually, I generally find the simple vibration of Dual Shock and similar systems to be useless at best, annoying at worst. I almost always turn it off on games that use it. Now true force feedback, on the other hand, is a totally different story.

Dual Shock is generally kind of useless, but I consider it handy and seldom turn it off because if I'm playing my PS2, it's usually because I'm playing a driving game or an FPS. The Metal Gear series used Dual Shock really well and like Mon Motha said, it relays useful information like the general wellbeing of your character and the like.

Post by **MonMotha** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 1:28 pm

CaseyDidder wrote:Honestly, if a little vibration in your hands throws your concentration off, you obviously can't seem to hold it very well.

I'm talking about playing a game like Pop'n Music or Beatmania with a DS2 controller. The controller vibrates with the beat of the music (unless you turn that feature off). While I can see this possibly being useful, it can be distracting if you're playing a part that is very arhythmic (like some of the scratch parts in IIDX). Of course, some may question why you'd play these kinds of games with a DS2 (I am teh 5-key god on a DS2, well not really).

Original Sin · Post by **Original Sin** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 5:05 pm

The Silent Hill series uses the vibration function as a health meter, so to speak. You can't actually see your status unless you pause/menu screen the game. So, taking away vibration could throw off games like that a bit, but not make them unplayable or anything.

seveneleven · Post by **seveneleven** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 4:58 am

letshavetea wrote:Narf Narf writes "According to Japan Today, the U.S. District Court in Oakland, California, has ordered Sony Computer Entertainment Inc. and its U.S. unit to pay $90.7 million in damages to Immersion Corp. for patent infringement over controllers used with PlayStation game consoles. In the ruling handed down Thursday, the federal court also ordered Sony Computer Entertainment and Sony Entertainment America Inc. to stop selling the PlayStation and PlayStation 2 game consoles using Dualshock controllers as well as more than 40 game software products." Update: 03/28 04:51 GMT by Z: ...which was followed immediately by an injunction, to allow Sony time for an appeal, and a compulsory licensing agreement.

read this on slashdot.com

these controllers have been around for like 10 years... why would they wait THIS LONG!?...

anyways... i wanna see whatll happen with this

well actually since they own the design by copyright they own it for 95 years ...so they could have sued SONY loooong after this

mexican ninja · Post by **mexican ninja** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 2:45 pm

seveneleven wrote:
letshavetea wrote:Narf Narf writes "According to Japan Today, the U.S. District Court in Oakland, California, has ordered Sony Computer Entertainment Inc. and its U.S. unit to pay $90.7 million in damages to Immersion Corp. for patent infringement over controllers used with PlayStation game consoles. In the ruling handed down Thursday, the federal court also ordered Sony Computer Entertainment and Sony Entertainment America Inc. to stop selling the PlayStation and PlayStation 2 game consoles using Dualshock controllers as well as more than 40 game software products." Update: 03/28 04:51 GMT by Z: ...which was followed immediately by an injunction, to allow Sony time for an appeal, and a compulsory licensing agreement.

read this on slashdot.com

these controllers have been around for like 10 years... why would they wait THIS LONG!?...

anyways... i wanna see whatll happen with this

well actually since they own the design by copyright they own it for 95 years ...so they could have sued SONY loooong after this

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