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Silent_Blade
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Post by Silent_Blade » Wed Mar 30, 2005 10:55 am

Pheadra wrote:
Silent_Blade wrote:
Ho wrote:I also agree. There's no excuse for the unkind remarks that often start a flamewar. However, I think the point is that flaming back--or even responding at all--does not help solve the problem and usually only adds to it. I agree that it's an unfair situation, but the response (or lack of) tends to isolate rather than exacerbate the unjustice.

It sucks that any of us have to be subjected to this kind of thing, but I'd much rather be a part of the solution than just another part of the problem.
Well yes, it's true that responding to a flame is just plain useless and can escalate the situation, however I don't believe it's as simple as you say to just ignore it. You see some people just like to start trouble, it's obvious from reading these forums.

When someone gets flamed they tend to respond back, but I don't believe it's for any other reason then to try and get back at them and punish them for their behavior. However the person who started the conflict is let off with no punishment, IndyDDR looks like a game of favourites to me. Those who started the flame war are usually rarely booed by people other then the attacked, meanwhile the attacked for responding to this unjustice are immediately booed.

The only real reason anyone would need to be subjected to this kind of behaviour is because the people that generally start the flamewars are old members, and nobody stops them (Fovouritism), I'm not asking for anyone to get banned, but some kind of punishment needs to be issued.

Maybe minimizing their posts to 10 posts a day or less ~ This would 'cause those who cause trouble to really put some thought into their posts and possibly think "Do I really want to waste my few posts on flaming?"

Possibly weeklong bans~ Well not much is needed in explanation.

I know you don't want to be the baby sitter Brian, but there needs to be some rules, and somekind of punishments need to be enforced. I mean IndyDDR is practically hostile to anyone considering joining the community because on the first page on conversations cornucopia there are like 4 or 5 threads that have been locked because the same people started flame wars.

I'd love the thought of a community without need for anyone in charge to keep it civil...If such a thing were possible, people just don't get along and that's why we have laws set down and people to enforce those laws IRL.

I know you put the rating system in to give the people the choice to who stays and who goes, but somehow the flamers always have somebody AAing their posts to keep them up high enough and out of danger no-matter how rude or offensive their post may have been.
Flamers stick together.
That is why we have the rating system! That is their punishment. Lets take Casey for example. He was standard, and now he is down to warning, he has limited posts that he can use and he cant even rate someone a 'great' if he wanted to....and surprise surprise Casey is one of the "oldies." There is no favoritism going on here...well its not as big as you believe it to be.

The injustice that you have noticed is abuse of the rating system, yes. But I believe the people that are using the rating system like it should be outweigh the ones that are abusing it.

Week long bans dont work. period.

The person who starts the flame war is "Punished" be getting 'booed' or 'miss' thats it. When someone responds to it they are going to get booed as well because they are just esculating the situation.

And btw it takes a mature person with patience and understand to ignore something. Like I said it isn't easy but you could at least give it a try.

Im not trying to step on your toes or anything its just that I have tried this whole 'ignoring' thing all my life and I seem to be a happy panda with rare conflicts in my life.

I'm still curious as to WHY anyone should have to ignore it?
The problem is lack of rules, the rating system is being abused that's obvious, Casey's in danger! Woohoo! So what? He can stay in danger all he wants but he's not getting banned, action needs to be taken before this forum can actually be friendly, because these few people who are starting all this crap are just pissing everyone off.

And I'm thoroughly ammused that you just kneel down and accept it when people treat you like dirt, congrats!

I'm terribly sorry, but I do believe most people don't appreciate getting dissed =P
Why can't we just take out the trash so that the majority of people can just get on with their lives and stop having to listen to all this flaming? it's obviously a problem but nobody seems to care enough to just get rid of them.

I also don't mean to step on your toes, but accepting peoples ignorance and their immaturity is senseless and wrong, it's wrong for you and it's wrong for them, they need to be informed of their flaws and punished for a shortwhile so they can ponder their past issues and ask themselves if it's really worthwhile.
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Post by Ho » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:01 am

I can really only control myself when it comes to playing favorites, and I try not to as much as I possibly can. I made a decision a long time ago that I wanted IndyDR to be an welcoming and inclusive community and not an exclusive clique or club.

I do the best I can to try to provide a place for all different kinds of people to co-exist--regardless of whatever personal feelings I may or may not have for them. So if it appears that I do not punish people very often, it is because I choose to err on the side of keeping people here rather than keeping people out. I realize this can create somewhat of a folly, but it is my philosophy nonetheless.

With regard to the ratings...I have noticed a rash of abuses lately. We've already taken some steps to correct or control them. We're also looking at ways of tweaking the system to make it better able to handle such abuses with less intervention. As I stated when it was introduced, this is a new thing and we're all learning how it works. Some adjustments may be necessary to help make the system better...some have already been made.
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Post by Ho » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:07 am

Silent_Blade wrote:I also don't mean to step on your toes, but accepting peoples ignorance and their immaturity is senseless and wrong, it's wrong for you and it's wrong for them, they need to be informed of their flaws and punished for a shortwhile so they can ponder their past issues and ask themselves if it's really worthwhile.
Casey has been banned more times than I can even remember from previous versions of this site. Bannings don't solve problems either. They may alleviate it for awhile, but either the problem comes back or a new problem comes to take its place.

Besides, banning people requires judgement. That in itself would be a manifestation of favoritism as I'm sure that there would be disagreement within the community on such an issue--even with someone as polarizing as Casey.
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Post by Silent_Blade » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:13 am

Ho wrote:
Silent_Blade wrote:I also don't mean to step on your toes, but accepting peoples ignorance and their immaturity is senseless and wrong, it's wrong for you and it's wrong for them, they need to be informed of their flaws and punished for a shortwhile so they can ponder their past issues and ask themselves if it's really worthwhile.
Casey has been banned more times than I can even remember from previous versions of this site. Bannings don't solve problems either. They may alleviate it for awhile, but either the problem comes back or a new problem comes to take its place.
I see...Hmm, very well.
I understand now, I'm simply saddened that the forum has become so hostile in the past few weeks =(
I just remember it being...Nicer a year or so ago, and I suppose I miss the feeling of people actually getting along instead of tearing eachothers heads off.

And I thank you for looking into the abuse of the rating systems =)

*Much happier*
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Post by Fujiwara Bunta » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:19 am

Ho wrote:
Silent_Blade wrote:I also don't mean to step on your toes, but accepting peoples ignorance and their immaturity is senseless and wrong, it's wrong for you and it's wrong for them, they need to be informed of their flaws and punished for a shortwhile so they can ponder their past issues and ask themselves if it's really worthwhile.
Casey has been banned more times than I can even remember from previous versions of this site. Bannings don't solve problems either. They may alleviate it for awhile, but either the problem comes back or a new problem comes to take its place.

Besides, banning people requires judgement. That in itself would be a manifestation of favoritism as I'm sure that there would be disagreement within the community on such an issue--even with someone as polarizing as Casey.
And if you ask me (even though it doesn't mean much), Casey has toned down a LOT from his previous forms. This is hardly anything to whine about - just him being immature (or me) and that's what we do best. Casey is NOT a terrible person, people. If you catch his or my style of satire and humor, you will get along with us just fine.

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Post by Ho » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:21 am

Silent_Blade wrote:I see...Hmm, very well.
I understand now, I'm simply saddened that the forum has become so hostile in the past few weeks =(
I just remember it being...Nicer a year or so ago, and I suppose I miss the feeling of people actually getting along instead of tearing eachothers heads off.

And I thank you for looking into the abuse of the rating systems =)

*Much happier*
You and I seek the same goal. I've just been here longer to see this cycle repeat itself several times and the uselessness of what might seem to be obvious remedies. I'm at least as frustrated as you are.
Last edited by Ho on Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Ho » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:23 am

Fujiwara Bunta wrote:And if you ask me (even though it doesn't mean much), Casey has toned down a LOT from his previous forms. This is hardly anything to whine about - just him being immature (or me) and that's what we do best. Casey is NOT a terrible person, people. If you catch his or my style of satire and humor, you will get along with us just fine.
Yes, but there is a lot to be said for choosing to function well within a group. I understand your 'satire and humor' as you call it. It doesn't bother me personally. My only issue with it is the negative effect it has on this group.
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Post by Silent_Blade » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:27 am

Fujiwara Bunta wrote:
Ho wrote:
Silent_Blade wrote:I also don't mean to step on your toes, but accepting peoples ignorance and their immaturity is senseless and wrong, it's wrong for you and it's wrong for them, they need to be informed of their flaws and punished for a shortwhile so they can ponder their past issues and ask themselves if it's really worthwhile.
Casey has been banned more times than I can even remember from previous versions of this site. Bannings don't solve problems either. They may alleviate it for awhile, but either the problem comes back or a new problem comes to take its place.

Besides, banning people requires judgement. That in itself would be a manifestation of favoritism as I'm sure that there would be disagreement within the community on such an issue--even with someone as polarizing as Casey.
And if you ask me (even though it doesn't mean much), Casey has toned down a LOT from his previous forms. This is hardly anything to whine about - just him being immature (or me) and that's what we do best. Casey is NOT a terrible person, people. If you catch his or my style of satire and humor, you will get along with us just fine.
I'm not blaming this completely on Casey or you. I'm simply saddened that some are begining to think it's alright to mock peoples death, I understand your sense of humour and most of the time I find you guys hillarious, but it leaves the newer members (Who might not know you guys) Thinking it's alright to flame/diss people not knowing you guys are joking. I'm simply asking for better examples to be set for the newer members.

Not to mention I just found that all the flaming directed at certain people was completely uncalled for, it's very diffecult to tell if people are joking or not when you're reading anyway =P
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Post by Silent_Blade » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:29 am

Ho wrote:
Silent_Blade wrote:I see...Hmm, very well.
I understand now, I'm simply saddened that the forum has become so hostile in the past few weeks =(
I just remember it being...Nicer a year or so ago, and I suppose I miss the feeling of people actually getting along instead of tearing eachothers heads off.

And I thank you for looking into the abuse of the rating systems =)

*Much happier*
You and I seek the same goal. I've just been here longer to see this cycle repeat itself several times and the uselessness of what might seem to be obvious remedies. I'm at least as frustrated as you are.
Yes I do understand and I thank you. Just to make myself clear =P I didn't mean to be rude or anything in my posts.

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Post by CaseyDidder » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:29 am

GOGOGOGO RATING SYSTEM

I'm back to standard :)

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Post by Fujiwara Bunta » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:30 am

Silent_Blade wrote:
Fujiwara Bunta wrote:
Ho wrote: Casey has been banned more times than I can even remember from previous versions of this site. Bannings don't solve problems either. They may alleviate it for awhile, but either the problem comes back or a new problem comes to take its place.

Besides, banning people requires judgement. That in itself would be a manifestation of favoritism as I'm sure that there would be disagreement within the community on such an issue--even with someone as polarizing as Casey.
And if you ask me (even though it doesn't mean much), Casey has toned down a LOT from his previous forms. This is hardly anything to whine about - just him being immature (or me) and that's what we do best. Casey is NOT a terrible person, people. If you catch his or my style of satire and humor, you will get along with us just fine.
I'm not blaming this completely on Casey or you. I'm simply saddened that some are begining to think it's alright to mock peoples death, I understand your sense of humour and most of the time I find you guys hillarious, but it leaves the newer members (Who might not know you guys) Thinking it's alright to flame/diss people not knowing you guys are joking. I'm simply asking for better examples to be set for the newer members.

Not to mention I just found that all the flaming directed at certain people was completely uncalled for, it's very diffecult to tell if people are joking or not when you're reading anyway =P
Yes, but my post wasn't directed at you. It was towards Ho, but you have valid points as well. I will admit that there are some times that we go overboard, and we're werkin' on that as well.

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Post by God Of Rock » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:31 am

Alright, time for me to inject my pompus, arrogant opinion here.

On the subject of flaming: It happens people. Get over it.
This is the intraweb, people don't have face to face contact
with you when they type, so they can get away with being
assholes. It happens. If you let it get to you, they win.
I don't have a problem with the way Casey/Joe/Etc post.
It's how they've always posted, and thats apparently how
they want to be percieved (sp?). They might not be the nicest
people on the boards, but I respect them same as everyone
else. I respect them because they have the skill to back up
the talk. I'm not saying no one else does, but Casey seems
to be the predominant example of bad behavor on the boards..

I think it's great that everyone is so concerned with how to punish
these people instead of just shrugging it off. So someone said
something mean to you on the interweb? O noes. My lifes are over.
IT'S JUST SOME TEXT AND NUMBERS FLOATING THROUGH SPACE.
There are infinite emotions to feel in life and you people are caught
up in vindiction and malice because YOU think someone should be
punished for something they said. If it pisses you off so much, go
do something else. And don't come back until you're mature enough
to see this board for what it really is.

I think it's great that everyone is so concerned with wanting everyone
to get along as a family. Really, I do. But families have problems. And
tempbans and lowered ranks won't make the problem go away. If you
really wanna be more like a family learn to accept these people for who
they are and how they carry themselves, instead of forcing them to
conform to what you deem acceptable behavior. I like Casey's posts. I
like them because Casey probably doesn't care what any of you think
of him when he posts it. That's what makes them enjoyable to read.
I'm not saying everyone has to like it, Im just saying that you should
accept the fact that he's here. Banning doesn't make the problem go
away.

Which brings me to another point. If you dont have a 'Moderator' tag
or an 'Admin' tag you really need to shut the hell up about punishments.
Ho, Jon, Brad, and Adam are mods for a reason. They know how to do
the job. They will decide if someone is out of line and act as they see fit.
If you don't like it, go make your own forum and lord over it however
you please. Stop telling them how to do their jobs. They got along fine
before we came along, so let it go.

In short for those of you just skimming this: Grow up, grow some thicker
skin, and stop telling the mods to do their job.


Seacrest, out.

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Post by CaseyDidder » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:33 am

I'm not, I jus haven't found anything good to flame lately :o Sin isn't giving me any bait, neither is Grubb, Silent is throwing it out like bird seed at a park, but Ho's watching this thread so ;) Anyways I had to wait till my rating was back up :O I couldn't even do a proper rating for a while because some ppl liked to abuse the rating system against my name.

Get over it silent_blade, you're being a baby because you couldn't have your way in a situation. Quit pretending the world revolves around you, or this forum for that matter.

Oh and I've been to busy with my PSP to flame anybody :O this thing is a total time whore.

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Post by Fujiwara Bunta » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:34 am

CaseyDidder wrote:I'm not, I jus haven't found anything good to flame lately :o Sin isn't giving me any bait, neither is Grubb, Silent is throwing it out like bird seed at a park, but Ho's watching this thread so ;) Anyways I had to wait till my rating was back up :O I couldn't even do a proper rating for a while because some ppl liked to abuse the rating system against my name.

Get over it silent_blade, you're being a baby because you couldn't have your way in a situation. Quit pretending the world revolves around you, or this forum for that matter.

Oh and I've been to busy with my PSP to flame anybody :O this thing is a total time whore.
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Post by Silent_Blade » Wed Mar 30, 2005 11:39 am

God Of Rock wrote:Alright, time for me to inject my pompus, arrogant opinion here.

On the subject of flaming: It happens people. Get over it.
This is the intraweb, people don't have face to face contact
with you when they type, so they can get away with being
assholes. It happens. If you let it get to you, they win.
I don't have a problem with the way Casey/Joe/Etc post.
It's how they've always posted, and thats apparently how
they want to be percieved (sp?). They might not be the nicest
people on the boards, but I respect them same as everyone
else. I respect them because they have the skill to back up
the talk. I'm not saying no one else does, but Casey seems
to be the predominant example of bad behavor on the boards..

I think it's great that everyone is so concerned with how to punish
these people instead of just shrugging it off. So someone said
something mean to you on the interweb? O noes. My lifes are over.
IT'S JUST SOME TEXT AND NUMBERS FLOATING THROUGH SPACE.
There are infinite emotions to feel in life and you people are caught
up in vindiction and malice because YOU think someone should be
punished for something they said. If it pisses you off so much, go
do something else. And don't come back until you're mature enough
to see this board for what it really is.

I think it's great that everyone is so concerned with wanting everyone
to get along as a family. Really, I do. But families have problems. And
tempbans and lowered ranks won't make the problem go away. If you
really wanna be more like a family learn to accept these people for who
they are and how they carry themselves, instead of forcing them to
conform to what you deem acceptable behavior. I like Casey's posts. I
like them because Casey probably doesn't care what any of you think
of him when he posts it. That's what makes them enjoyable to read.
I'm not saying everyone has to like it, Im just saying that you should
accept the fact that he's here. Banning doesn't make the problem go
away.

Which brings me to another point. If you dont have a 'Moderator' tag
or an 'Admin' tag you really need to shut the hell up about punishments.
Ho, Jon, Brad, and Adam are mods for a reason. They know how to do
the job. They will decide if someone is out of line and act as they see fit.
If you don't like it, go make your own forum and lord over it however
you please. Stop telling them how to do their jobs. They got along fine
before we came along, so let it go.

In short for those of you just skimming this: Grow up, grow some thicker
skin, and stop telling the mods to do their job.


Seacrest, out.
Well alright then, I'm terribly sorry for giving my input =( I'll never do it again, I'm such a moron for thinking that since everyone else gave their input I should maybe try and help too =P

I was never trying to get anyone perminantly banned I was simply trying to tell them my concerns.
I know perfectly well Casey and Joe are not bad people, I just sometimes find their humorous behaviour spreading onto the newer member who don't know that's just how they are, and don't know it's simply playing.
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