Homemade Tatsujin Movie

beatmania, beatmaniaIIDX, beatmania III

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Amp Divorax
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Post by Amp Divorax » Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:03 pm

Ho wrote:What is this IIDX Bible DVD? Should I see this?

As for making videos...come visit and we shall make some. Your actual gameplay is likely to be more impressive than mine.
The IIDX bible DVD was released when RED came out in the arcades and it had some Tatsujin vids.

REV-S's vids from the DVD:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IJoGJ0RSGo (1st Samurai Another)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zksz785y ... ed&search= (Moon_Child Another)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UksQyIoP ... ed&search= (Rainbow Flyer Another)

There were also one handed videos for TAIYO and Spiral Galaxy on Hyper , a doubles vid for Quazar Another with autoturntable on, and a vid for Gigadelic Hyper, but I cannot find them currently. While there have been psychotically better scores since this DVD came out, it was a great example of some of the best players playing that arcade release for the first time.

As for stopping in, setup a time to stop in and we should be able to make that happen with no problem.
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Post by Ho » Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:50 pm

I'm guessing the IIDX Bible was a fan-produced DVD and not a Konami release?

The only thing those videos have that mine don't is the score and life bar displays during gameplay. I'm not sure how important they really are. Serious IIDX players don't seem to care much about money score, and in a serious tatsujin movie the life bar shouldn't be much of an issue. In theory, you can get that information from the results screen at the end. Do you have any thoughts on their inclusion/exclusion?

And we will definitely have to setup a little tatusjin party. The only catch is that you'd have to get used to playing on my monitor. ;)
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Post by Amp Divorax » Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:15 pm

Ho wrote:I'm guessing the IIDX Bible was a fan-produced DVD and not a Konami release?

The only thing those videos have that mine don't is the score and life bar displays during gameplay. I'm not sure how important they really are. Serious IIDX players don't seem to care much about money score, and in a serious tatsujin movie the life bar shouldn't be much of an issue. In theory, you can get that information from the results screen at the end. Do you have any thoughts on their inclusion/exclusion?

And we will definitely have to setup a little tatusjin party. The only catch is that you'd have to get used to playing on my monitor. ;)
Actually, it was a Konami release. Personally on a Tatsujin vid I think showing the datachart or using the option to show what you've gotten during the song in the BGvid window (as seen on http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CggijBUaK8) and placing that somewhere on the screen.

As for adjusting the timing window I would probably set it to 0 or -1 to match the sync I get on a lagfree display.
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Post by MonMotha » Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:30 pm

The plasma on that machine is about as lag free as it gets. Actual lag seems to be about a field to a full frame, depending on how you attempt to measure it. Watch the delay (frame by frame) from the key light lighting up to the note column graphic activatin on screen. It's about 1 frame, and the video is 30fps. Note also that the keylight activation is rounded up to the next poll from the playstation, which occurs at the field rate of 60Hz.

A fully analog CRT might be less laggy, but it wouldn't be by much. Even with IIDX, I have trouble noticing a single frame of latency. I notice no difference between my (analog, at least in terms of video display path) arcade monitor and that plasma in terms of latency. The only thing that gets me is the size.
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Post by Ho » Mon Aug 20, 2007 9:11 pm

Amp Divorax wrote:Actually, it was a Konami release.
Was it a Konami release of fan-produced video? In my opinion, the tatsujins you linked appeared to have lower production values than the ones in 6th Style. That's not to say they're bad, but the 6th Style videos seem more consistent and professional. Still, if you have the DVD, I would appreciate an opportunity to see it.
Amp Divorax wrote:Personally on a Tatsujin vid I think showing the datachart or using the option to show what you've gotten during the song in the BGvid window (as seen on http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CggijBUaK8) and placing that somewhere on the screen.
By "data chart," are you talking about the bar graphs on the side? I could probably get that into the video. For "option to show what you've gotten," I'm assuming you mean the counters for PGREAT, GREAT, GOOD, BAD, and POOR. I could probably get those in somewhere, too...except those don't display in double play on Happy Sky.

And since you didn't mention them, I'm guessing you don't really care about money score or life gauge?



Note to all: I have replaced the video with a new version (same filename). I noticed that the audio went way out of sync in the middle. MonMotha correctly assessed that my choice of VBR audio doesn't play nice in the AVI format. I replaced it with CBR audio and the audio is now properly synchronized throughout. Redownload the video if you want to see/hear it correctly.
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Post by Amp Divorax » Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:52 pm

I don't have the original files anymore for the DVD unfortunately, but that bemani site that I cannot mention on here has it and the vids were made by Konami. Part of the problem with what is on youtube is that the video has been recompressed to hell and back. As for money score it's not really necessary since it has no substansial effect on gameplay. Likewise the healthbar isn't really necessary since you can see it on the left side of the screen.
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Post by Ho » Tue Aug 21, 2007 8:55 am

I wasn't referring to the video quality itself. I pretty much expect videos on YouTube to look like poop. Lord knows that some of my videos have turned up on YouTube (through no action of my own) and they generally look like they've gone through some sort of horrific pixel-smashing experiment.

I was referring to inconsistencies in the videos themselves. For instance, in one of the three videos, the overhead camera is at a different angle...and a little crooked. And in all of those videos, the overhead angle seems tipped back awkwardly rather than directly overhead. I remember the 6th Style videos being much more consistent and professional about details like that.
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Post by lgolem » Tue Aug 21, 2007 1:31 pm

Ho wrote:Image
*Listens to song* I feel like going on a quest *Picks up sword to go kill some slimes*

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Post by Ho » Tue Aug 21, 2007 2:22 pm

If you like that, you should also play/listen to Beyond the Earth. Sayonara Heaven is essentially the sequel to Beyond the Earth. They are Contemporary Nation 2 and Contemporary Nation in pop'n music.
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Post by Amp Divorax » Tue Aug 21, 2007 3:45 pm

Ho wrote:I wasn't referring to the video quality itself. I pretty much expect videos on YouTube to look like poop. Lord knows that some of my videos have turned up on YouTube (through no action of my own) and they generally look like they've gone through some sort of horrific pixel-smashing experiment.

I was referring to inconsistencies in the videos themselves. For instance, in one of the three videos, the overhead camera is at a different angle...and a little crooked. And in all of those videos, the overhead angle seems tipped back awkwardly rather than directly overhead. I remember the 6th Style videos being much more consistent and professional about details like that.
That I can't really explain and didn't really noticed until now cause usually I'm paying attention to the ingame video.
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Post by Jizzon » Tue Aug 21, 2007 4:53 pm

Just as a semi-related FYI...

...YouTube quality might be in for a real upgrade.

Now, when people rip your videos and, uhm...Tubify...them, maybe they'll look much better before long :wink:

As a side note: We should totally make some Brain Age 2 tatsujins :P
Last edited by Jizzon on Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Ho » Tue Aug 21, 2007 5:00 pm

Oh man...that's HUGE!

And to your second point, I'd love to make some non-obvious (read: ridiculous) tatsujins just for gits and shiggles.

BTW, when will we get to see all that fighting game stuff you shot on your birthday?
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Post by Amp Divorax » Tue Aug 21, 2007 6:10 pm

About f*cking time! Speaking of which will we start seeing vids at 640x352 using H.264 on here?
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Post by MonMotha » Tue Aug 21, 2007 6:32 pm

Amp Divorax wrote:About f*cking time! Speaking of which will we start seeing vids at 640x352 using H.264 on here?
Go to the last couple of tournaments before the hosting was provided by an offsite host. That host prefers xvid/MP3 in AVI containers, so that's what gets used. The "mkv" files are 288 lines, square pixel (so horizontal varies by aspect ratio) h.264 video with Vorbis audio. Total stream rate was about 128-192kbps. The frame size was chosen as a compromise between full size, which required about 256-384kbps to look decent, and QVGA. Tests with QVGA did allow acceptable performance down to about 96kbps streams, at which point the audio became a limiting factor in terms of bitrate. I did not have an MPEG4 AAC-HE encoder available to use for testing, and Vorbis seemed to do better than my AAC encoder at those low bitrates (<30kbps).

640x352 gives a weird pixel aspect ratio for just about any standard frame aspect ratio...

I'll be interested to see if Flash's h.264 decoding support is as limited as Quicktime's. Quicktime's h.264 almost degrades to MPEG4 ASP due to its lack of support for large frameref, multiple b-frames, b-frames predicted from b-frames, different quantization matrices, etc. If Flash supports all the goodies and their encoder (which you'll likely be required to use to produce flash video) doesn't totally suck ass, then it should substantially improve the quality of most flash videos.
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Post by liquidblue aka DBV » Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:02 pm

MonMotha wrote:640x352 gives a weird pixel aspect ratio for just about any standard frame aspect ratio...
Not always. Not to be animu here, but death note episodes are generally exported out onto the internet as 640x360; however, if you lower it to 352, it becomes divisible by 16, and compresses a lot better. (plus it doesn't really look odd at all, or that much different than 360.)

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