Religion...and the discussion of it

IndyDDR's online socialization center: general topics not related to specific coverage areas

Moderator: Moderators

User avatar
TylerHHS
Standard
Standard
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:51 pm
Location: Fort Wayne
Contact:

Post by TylerHHS » Sun Feb 20, 2005 12:25 am

I guess I'm a bit of an agnostic, I think there is a higher being, yes. Do I care? Not really.

I have no 100% without a doubt proof that Jesus is the savior of the world. As such, how do I know I'm not wasting my time every Sunday when I could be sleeping, playing Halo 2, working on homework, or doing almost anything else? I don't, and Christians say "well you just have to have faith that he exists." That's not good enough for me.

User avatar
Original Sin
Heavy
Heavy
Posts: 1985
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:18 am
Location: Fort Wayne
Contact:

Post by Original Sin » Sun Feb 20, 2005 1:04 am

I could have faith that my car is indestructable, and drive it into a solid steel wall, but that's not gonna save my life.
Having faith in something is fine, but you need something more than that. Faith alone is little more than make believe: You can have faith in anything, but it doesn't necessarily make it true.
Now, if you find truth in something, if you find something to make you believe, something that proves to you that it exists, and you have faith in it, that's something different. But just believing in something because another human being told you to doesn't mean it exists, and certainly doesn't give you the go ahead to judge others and say they're wrong, when you yourself don't even know if you're right.
There are very few things that I believe beyond a shadow of a doubt, and these are the things I have seen and experienced for myself. Now, using these things, and other ideas I have gathered, I have begun to piece together my beliefs, my 'faith,' if you will.
It's fine to disagree with someone. But up and saying 'You're wrong!' when the only proof you have is your own belief in it doesn't make you right, and it sure as hell doesn't make them wrong.

User avatar
andyisntemo
Standard
Standard
Posts: 32
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:04 pm
Location: Avon
Contact:

Post by andyisntemo » Sun Feb 20, 2005 2:35 pm

Original Sin wrote:I could have faith that my car is indestructable, and drive it into a solid steel wall, but that's not gonna save my life.
Having faith in something is fine, but you need something more than that. Faith alone is little more than make believe: You can have faith in anything, but it doesn't necessarily make it true.
Now, if you find truth in something, if you find something to make you believe, something that proves to you that it exists, and you have faith in it, that's something different. But just believing in something because another human being told you to doesn't mean it exists, and certainly doesn't give you the go ahead to judge others and say they're wrong, when you yourself don't even know if you're right.
There are very few things that I believe beyond a shadow of a doubt, and these are the things I have seen and experienced for myself. Now, using these things, and other ideas I have gathered, I have begun to piece together my beliefs, my 'faith,' if you will.
It's fine to disagree with someone. But up and saying 'You're wrong!' when the only proof you have is your own belief in it doesn't make you right, and it sure as hell doesn't make them wrong.
YES! You are my favourite!
It's like...I have a Christian faith...screwed up? sure.
But I'm not about to tell my muslim friend, Fati, that she's wrong just because I say so.
Because that's ghey! yayyy!
A Song:
Yay for siggys
there's an anime character name shiggy
well really his name is shigure
something that rhymes with Shigure

YES!

User avatar
Tangent
Beginner
Beginner
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2005 5:58 pm

Post by Tangent » Sun Feb 20, 2005 3:22 pm

I'm Jewish, but I'm an atheist. If you're born Jewish, you can't really just get out of it; it's more of a racial thing.

Anyway, I don't have a problem with God or Jesus or anything like that; I have a problem with religion itself. It causes so many wars and hurts so much more than it helps that it's just silly now. The fundamentalists from all the religions pervert the meanings, yes, I know, but the fact remains that people still use God as a means to justify their actions -- take a look at Bush, for example. I just hate that people can use this and effectively dodge criticism because of their beliefs.

...I guess I don't really have much else to say unless someone speaks up violently against my belief :?
Image
beatmaniaIIDX 5th Style
When a sound and light fuse, an entertainment of shock to accept breath is created.

User avatar
Original Sin
Heavy
Heavy
Posts: 1985
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:18 am
Location: Fort Wayne
Contact:

Post by Original Sin » Sun Feb 20, 2005 3:54 pm

You're right. Throughout history, people have used religion to justify all sorts of horrible things. While individiual people of a religion may not be bad, they are easily misled by the church. Most large churches and religious organizations wind up guilty of corruption and greed somewhere along the way as well...just happened recently in the Fort, too.

User avatar
TylerHHS
Standard
Standard
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:51 pm
Location: Fort Wayne
Contact:

Post by TylerHHS » Sun Feb 20, 2005 7:30 pm

Another thing: I can't stand many Catholics. Sorry to any on this board, but so many think that they are superior to Protestant faiths.

IF there is a Heaven and a God, then I highly doubt that God will favor Catholics over Protestants.

Also, I hate how Catholics are on the warpath against homosexuals and premarital sex when they have priests raping little boys. Sorry, I guess I just don't like hyprocrites.

User avatar
Original Sin
Heavy
Heavy
Posts: 1985
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:18 am
Location: Fort Wayne
Contact:

Post by Original Sin » Sun Feb 20, 2005 9:23 pm

Most of them that I've met, many of them being my dad's side of the family, are extremely closed minded, and harshly judgemental. I'm not saying they all are, but of the ones I've met, there's only been a select few who have been reasonable and friendly. Furthermore, I frankly don't think god gives a fuck what denomination of christianity you are, not in the slighest. They were created by man after all, not him, so why should he care? however, belittling everyone else certianly isn't going to get you front of the line tickets to the pearly gates.

User avatar
mexican ninja
Heavy
Heavy
Posts: 1016
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 9:17 pm
Location: Fort Sweet
Contact:

Post by mexican ninja » Sun Feb 20, 2005 10:36 pm

I think I'm catholic.

I spent ten years in a catholic school. Lemme tell you something, that kinda stuff messes a kid up hardcore. I mean, just look at me!

I loved how my religon teacher tried to justify the priests scandle, by saying it was only a very small percent of priests. By this logic, we could say that only a very small precent of muslims are insane enough to fly a plane into a building, so it's ok.

Man I hated that school.

User avatar
Original Sin
Heavy
Heavy
Posts: 1985
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:18 am
Location: Fort Wayne
Contact:

Post by Original Sin » Mon Feb 21, 2005 7:15 am

Can't say I'm a fan of religious schools...some of them push so many ideals into a kids head, they don't even know how to think for themselves when they're old enough to. When I have kids, I'll teach them what I know when they're ready for it, and let them make their own decision...I don't understand parents who force religious ideals on their kids...it's one thing to teach them, it's entirely another thing to cram things they don't want to believe in into their soul.

IceDraco
Light
Light
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2005 2:22 am
Location: Ft Wayne, IN
Contact:

Post by IceDraco » Sat Feb 26, 2005 2:40 am

hay guys! im a newby on indyDDR, but i have something to say about this stuff in here now then yet.

READ A BOOK CALLED PAGAN CHRISTIANITY, it is written by Frank Viola (and no he dosn't play baseball!)

I am a Christian, [b]HOWEVER!!![/b] i do not go to "chruch" because there are lots of things wrong with chruch. Like, there should be no pastor/clergy. because there was none after Christ left. read pagan christianity.

It isn't a book dissing christians or anything like that, it is more of a history book of the way the "chruch" got corrupted and the way it started and the big differences between the two.

User avatar
Ebola Gay
Standard
Standard
Posts: 234
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 11:17 am
Location: Outside your bedroom window, cleverly hidden by shrubs.

Post by Ebola Gay » Sat Feb 26, 2005 2:44 am

IceDraco wrote:i do not go to "chruch" because there are lots of things wrong with chruch. Like, there should be no pastor/clergy. because there was none after Christ left.
... What about the disciples? I mean, they obviously existed after Christ's leaving, and going from town to town, preaching the word and all that, I dunno, that kinda sounds like a pastor to me.
Signatures sure are awesome.

User avatar
Original Sin
Heavy
Heavy
Posts: 1985
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:18 am
Location: Fort Wayne
Contact:

Post by Original Sin » Sat Feb 26, 2005 2:12 pm

I think what he's refering to is the church's insistence that the clergy are touched by god, and do his will, which as most of us know is not true. They're humans just like the rest of us, no more fit to make decisions on the word of god than you, me, or anyone else. They have a profound knowledge of the 'written word of god,' or more accurately, the word of the church. Not god him/herself.

IceDraco
Light
Light
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2005 2:22 am
Location: Ft Wayne, IN
Contact:

Post by IceDraco » Sun Feb 27, 2005 10:15 pm

There is a verry big difference between what the diciples did in going out and shareing the Word of God with people and what pastors do on a weekly basis. (im going to make MOST christians angry and im sorry) They preach to the same group every week and tell them things that they should already know, if they read there Bible and talk to God on any kind of a normal basis. But what the disiples did is they went out and made more disiples. they didn't go out and make followers, they just got people on the path to Christ and then gave them the word and let them walk.

Did you know that it took Paul YEARS before he ever went out on a trip to any other city at all. it wasn't a one night thing, it took him a long time to relern everything that he knew about God and Christ. And this was PAUL!!!! he wrote the most books in the NT and it took him years before he was ready to be used by God. "To live is Christ, To die is gain"


And thank you original sin for seeing the truth in that matter.
Clergy and pastors are no closer to God than you and I can be. But you have to give up everything and follow Him.
It dosn't have to be all at once (it almost never is) you start out as a baby with Christ and He teaches you, and you grow. He is truly a dad, he is the best dad.

He dosn't get angry when you sin or mess up, he gets dissapointed. (just like most fathers) As long as you tern from your error, there is no sin or bad deed that you can do that He will not forgive you for.

oh yeah!!! and about the gay thing why do you think God berned 2 citys to ash???? HMMMM?!?!?!?! He diceded to be trogdor fo a few min and just kill them all! Because they wouldn't tern from the sin.

User avatar
Ebola Gay
Standard
Standard
Posts: 234
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 11:17 am
Location: Outside your bedroom window, cleverly hidden by shrubs.

Post by Ebola Gay » Mon Feb 28, 2005 2:46 am

IceDraco wrote:what the disiples did is they went out and made more disiples. they didn't go out and make followers, they just got people on the path to Christ and then gave them the word and let them walk.
Personally, I believe that's because back then, there wasn't a church at every corner like there is today. You needed to travel and spread the word. Doing what we do today just woulden't be feasable, we'd just have one big lump of believers in one spot, and that doesn't do much good. Plus, I'd wager that a majority of the people that they "let walk" just chilled and did what modern pastors do, which is help lead other, younger christians on the path. Which leads me to my next point...
IceDraco wrote:They preach to the same group every week and tell them things that they should already know, if they read there Bible and talk to God on any kind of a normal basis.
In a perfect world, all christians would know the bible and how to correctly interpet it and all that by themselfs. The sad fact is, you coulden't get much farther from the truth, most of the time. Don't get me wrong, I'm not calling us stupid or anything, but as it sometimes happens in all religions, people put their personal beliefs into the mix. I've met people who've thought black people, coffeeshops, and my hair were all evil, or in the the case of my hair, against the will of God. I ask them why, and they always, always, pull out a passage of scripture that usually means something completely different. The fact is, most people need a person to help 'em out a lil' on understanding this stuff, thus, pastors.

God, this is a long post.
Signatures sure are awesome.

User avatar
Mr. Worm
Standard
Standard
Posts: 115
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 10:23 pm
Location: Indianapolis, IN / Washington, DC
Contact:

Post by Mr. Worm » Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:16 am

Personally, I believe that Catholism has screwed up Christianity more than anything. Don't get me wrong, some Protestant faiths are flawed.

It's just that Catholic Church elevates itself above everything. I believe that if you trust in God/Jesus, you'll be saved. I can't believe that taking the Eucharist at a Catholic Mass is considered condemning non-Catholics. At my church, any who have accepted Christ take it.

I think this hypocrisy through the different sects is what makes Christianity look weak. Look at me, I condemn the Catholic Church....hypocritical, no?

My faith is about becoming closer to God, enduring pain and sharing in the suffering of Christ, and attempting to become perfect, knowing that I will never obtain it while I remain in this human flesh.

I'm just a starting Christian....only been for about a year and a half definately. I'm still working some of this stuff out.
Image

Post Reply